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  Author    Mini Marcos MK3  (currently 2,683 views)
Lars Kristian
Posted on: October 10th, 2005, 13:00:08 Quote Report to Moderator
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Looking for a mk3 chassis for racing purpose.

My needs: super lightweight chassis with crossmember (alu/magnesium : ) or light stainless steel (to prevent rust). full FIA rollcage, strengthen floor for the seat - space for weber - all painted in one piece.

Anyone?

For inspiration - look at the white one:
http://www.tonythompsonracing.co.uk/Racecars_for_sale_.html

Best regards

lars kristian

Mini Marcos "26R"
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Volker
Posted on: November 26th, 2005, 16:12:38 Quote Report to Moderator
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Hi Lars,
do you want to take part in historic racing or a kind of "modsport"?
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: November 27th, 2005, 05:25:56 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Volker, posted November 26th, 2005, 16:12:38 at here
Hi Lars,
do you want to take part in historic racing or a kind of "modsport"?



App K, periode G1 (66-69) historic racing in N, S and DK, but same regulations as European championship.
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: April 18th, 2006, 11:21:15 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Lars Kristian, posted November 27th, 2005, 05:25:56 at here


App K, periode G1 (66-69) historic racing in N, S and DK, but same regulations as European championship.



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Neil KilBane
Posted on: April 18th, 2006, 14:08:09 Quote Report to Moderator
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just a little fine tuning left to do.


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Looks lovely Lars.

 
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Andy Seward
Posted on: April 20th, 2006, 00:41:06 Quote Report to Moderator
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270 DGJ at the 1966 'Ring 500km Race


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It certain does!  Really well done, Lars.  How did you get the wheel openings to be a bit, well... more open?  

I'd really like to see more photos.. it looks to be in excellent condition.

Best Regards,
Andy

"When you come to a fork in the road....take it."
                                       - Yogi Berra, Manager, New York Yankees

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Lars Kristian
Posted on: April 20th, 2006, 06:56:22 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Andy Seward, posted April 20th, 2006, 00:41:06 at here
It certain does!  Really well done, Lars.  How did you get the wheel openings to be a bit, well... more open?  

I'd really like to see more photos.. it looks to be in excellent condition.

Best Regards,
Andy



Its Stef Jones' old car chnr 7153. Edwin Solheim and I have had it in pieces and upgraded several parts, but the wheel openings is not our work... It used to run on 12'' or 13''


Last modified April 20th, 2006, 06:57:13 by Lars Kristian
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admin
Posted on: April 20th, 2006, 11:16:58 Quote Report to Moderator
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There are two more photos on the Members' Cars section, courtesy of Lars.
http://www.minimarcos.org.uk/memcars/7153/
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Volker
Posted on: April 21st, 2006, 22:20:36 Quote Report to Moderator
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Great looking car Lars , looks better than a 26R!
Have you put on a weight scale already?
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: April 24th, 2006, 08:03:16 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Volker, posted April 21st, 2006, 22:20:36 at here
Great looking car Lars , looks better than a 26R!
Have you put on a weight scale already?




No Volker, 2-3 weeks time. Thats the big moment....
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admin
Posted on: April 26th, 2006, 20:57:21
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Just came across this. i think I got it from Geir Hansen.

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Lars Kristian
Posted on: June 21st, 2006, 07:50:51 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Volker, posted April 21st, 2006, 22:20:36 at here
Great looking car Lars , looks better than a 26R!
Have you put on a weight scale already?




Weight scales yesterday. 585 kg. 386 kg front ant 197 kg rear. Need to loose weight, some 40-50 kg.....

This included 12 litres of fuel, but without water. The roll cage and Sparco chair is many kilos, but i prefer to have this for security reasons.

Where do I start to cut  
Rear frame has not been modified (drilled). Std swingarms, Hi-Lo etc, in other words std S.
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paul harcourt
Posted on: June 21st, 2006, 17:07:29 Quote Report to Moderator
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How about an aluminium cylinder head Lars?
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: June 22nd, 2006, 07:56:02 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from paul harcourt, posted June 21st, 2006, 17:07:29 at here
How about an aluminium cylinder head Lars?



The head has to be cast iron according to the homologation papers.

Rae Davis states in the article on the Goodwood-marcos that "the usual rear subframe setup is replaced by a lightweight beam axle, which Marcos homologated for racing but never used in 1966".

A proof or document on this, or even better - the homologationpaper for this, would have been valuable for me!

This could have saved me a lot of kg.

Anyone with knowledge here?

Last modified June 22nd, 2006, 08:00:43 by Lars Kristian
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Volker
Posted on: June 22nd, 2006, 09:40:57 Quote Report to Moderator
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Hi Lars,

if you want to fit a rear beam (like the Speedex one) you need to fit coil-over shocks as well, please consider that this could give you some wheel arch clearance problems due to the 2.25" springs. It will save you almost the total weight of the original rear frame. Try to find some alloy trainling arms to save some further weight.

Volker
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admin
Posted on: June 22nd, 2006, 10:04:25 Quote Report to Moderator
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... then add a bag of cement to keep the back end down
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: June 22nd, 2006, 13:03:07 Quote Report to Moderator
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Ok,

The car had coil over when Stef drove it, but with the std swing arms and subframe. But the question is what FIA say - or what I shall tell them....

Anyone know what Rae Davis talking about?
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paul harcourt
Posted on: June 22nd, 2006, 15:54:30 Quote Report to Moderator
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I have seen a period beam axle for a mini that used a large diameter tube fixed between the rear hubs and fabricated lightweight tubes as trailing arms, this also used coil overs.
A bit like the rear live axle setup on a Fiat panda.
Mabey this was the type that Marcos homoligated?
Anybody know if this worked or not? I saw this on an aoutocross Mini in the early seventies.
The weirdest set up I remember had 3' long coilovers that went right up through the wheel arch angled forward to bolt to the rollover hoop, this gave the car incredible wheel travel for leaping over the jumps.

Last modified June 22nd, 2006, 15:59:04 by paul harcourt
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John Dickens
Posted on: June 26th, 2006, 08:42:00 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from paul harcourt, posted June 22nd, 2006, 15:54:30 at here
I have seen a period beam axle for a mini that used a large diameter tube fixed between the rear hubs and fabricated lightweight tubes as trailing arms, this also used coil overs.
A bit like the rear live axle setup on a Fiat panda.
Mabey this was the type that Marcos homoligated?
Anybody know if this worked or not? I saw this on an aoutocross Mini in the early seventies.
The weirdest set up I remember had 3' long coilovers that went right up through the wheel arch angled forward to bolt to the rollover hoop, this gave the car incredible wheel travel for leaping over the jumps.




I fabricated a beam 'dead' axle for my racer. (the car that Marcos Heritage are calling their Mk. VI GT).




I was not allowed to use spherical joints in the class I was racing so I used track rod ends on 2 parallel lower links and 2 diagonal upper links. It was a big improvement over the usual trailing arm independent suspension.
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paul harcourt
Posted on: June 26th, 2006, 09:28:47 Quote Report to Moderator
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Hi John,
Did you make any drawings for your dead axle so that it could be replicated?
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John Dickens
Posted on: June 26th, 2006, 11:15:44 Quote Report to Moderator
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I did but I used them as templates when I was welding it up so they didn't survive.
I could give you a brief outline of the basics and sketch what I did but the dimensions I more or less made up as I went along.
I did pay attention to the advice in the Vizard 'Modify your Mini' book and set the roll centre very high.
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Pete Crudgington
Posted on: June 29th, 2006, 12:35:17 Quote Report to Moderator
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Rae's car is fitted with a Maguire Mini Rear beam and Maguire fabricated rear arms, these were made in the lat 70's or early 80's when Maguire were doing the Maguire minis.  He probably got Jem to write a letter to the FIA saying it was O.K. to use them and that he had infact used them in 1966!

The homolgation papers show a full front and rear subframe with no options of any thing else. (Rubber is the spring medium, so no coil overs allowed!).

The alloy KAD arms are best avoided, we have had them bend on us when using slicks on Julian Howells mini.
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: June 29th, 2006, 12:57:23 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from Pete Crudgington, posted June 29th, 2006, 12:35:17 at here
Rae's car is fitted with a Maguire Mini Rear beam and Maguire fabricated rear arms, these were made in the lat 70's or early 80's when Maguire were doing the Maguire minis.  He probably got Jem to write a letter to the FIA saying it was O.K. to use them and that he had infact used them in 1966!

The homolgation papers show a full front and rear subframe with no options of any thing else. (Rubber is the spring medium, so no coil overs allowed!).

The alloy KAD arms are best avoided, we have had them bend on us when using slicks on Julian Howells mini.




Thank you very much. Highly appreciated information! I was on my way to order KAD swing arms.

/lars kristian
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Chris Pearson
Posted on: June 30th, 2006, 15:26:54 Quote Report to Moderator
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Specialist components are doing billet radius arms now.  Very ligh but no provision for a knuckle joint so coil over suspension is a must.
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Stuart
Posted on: June 30th, 2006, 19:36:07 Quote Report to Moderator
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And here they are, only for the well heeled!

http://www.specialist-componen.....amp;prodCategoryID=4
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Neil KilBane
Posted on: July 1st, 2006, 09:24:40 Quote Report to Moderator
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just a little fine tuning left to do.


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Some nice stuff on there.

 
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: July 18th, 2006, 09:11:33 Quote Report to Moderator
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Finally in action.

Overheating after 3 laps, far too much brakes at rear, driving position suited for a monkey etc etc. Many things to sort out, but that the name of the game.


Last modified July 18th, 2006, 17:23:50 by Lars Kristian
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admin
Posted on: July 18th, 2006, 10:01:05 Quote Report to Moderator
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You need the small diameter slave cylinders on the back i.e 850/Cooper 'S' type with matching backplates. Even then an adjustable brake bias valve is useful, especially in the wet.
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: July 18th, 2006, 17:29:03 Quote Report to Moderator
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Quoted from admin, posted July 18th, 2006, 10:01:05 at here
You need the small diameter slave cylinders on the back i.e 850/Cooper 'S' type with matching backplates. Even then an adjustable brake bias valve is useful, especially in the wet.




I know. Have an adjustable one under the bonnet, but couldn't reach this during the 3-4 laps i raced before overheating
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paul harcourt
Posted on: July 21st, 2006, 22:34:34 Quote Report to Moderator
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John when you ran your racer with the dead beam axle, did you have to remove or cut into the spare wheel well and battery tray to allow for suspension movement?
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John Dickens
Posted on: July 22nd, 2006, 08:57:17 Quote Report to Moderator
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Now you're asking!

Its a long time since I did this but I think I made the whole boot floor flat. I may even have had to put a raised section in as I made the roll centre very high so the diagonal links were mounted on a tower above the main tube.



This is roughly how it was set up.
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paul harcourt
Posted on: July 22nd, 2006, 09:19:50
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Very interesting John thank you, the reason I am asking is that I have just purchased a dead beam axle with the intention of modifying it to fit as a future project.
I will have to get brake back plates welded on and a pair of coil overs to fit, but I am a bit worried about the torque action of the brakes with the welded trailing arms.
What do you think?

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John Dickens
Posted on: July 22nd, 2006, 22:36:59 Quote Report to Moderator
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I don't see how that set up can work. What happens when the body starts to roll or one wheel hits a bump? If all 3 trailing arms are welded to the axle then there's no articulation. The axle can only move up and down equally at both sides.

Maybe I'm not seeing it right?

The other drawback seems to be that the roll centre is at axle height. The Vizard recommendation is for it to be much higher.
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paul harcourt
Posted on: July 23rd, 2006, 08:57:20 Quote Report to Moderator
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Yes I see what you mean, I will have to re-think this, possibly cut the trailing arms off and weld brackets to take them.
Seemed like a bargain at the time, but looks like it could start costing a fair bit in alloy welding !
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John Dickens
Posted on: July 24th, 2006, 08:03:52 Quote Report to Moderator
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Don't take my word for it. Try it out. It's already assembled so clamp the 2 brackets to something solid like a bench then see if you can move the axle beam freely up and down and also up one side and down the other.
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: August 1st, 2006, 08:47:38 Quote Report to Moderator
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Hi guys.

I have problem with the wiper motor. Got a brand new from mini spares with 110 degrees nylon ring. Mini mk2.
http://www.minispares.com/images/products/200/GXE7708.jpg

The problem is that it also wipes ca 20 cm on each side of the bonnet....

Any ideas? Can I swap the nylon ring to 80 degrees one - and where do i find this?
Its placed on the right hand side hence weber box. Std mini wiper wheel box etc. Planning to use just one arm. No wiper now....

best reg
lars kristian

Last modified August 1st, 2006, 09:51:05 by Lars Kristian
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admin
Posted on: August 1st, 2006, 12:35:31 Quote Report to Moderator
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This is the permanent magnet motor. I'm not sure what you mean by the 'nylon ring' but you can swap the big nylon gearwheel. The radius of the crank pin determines the throw of the rack. It  may be possible to drill a new hole and relocate the pin. However it would be easier to change the wheelboxes for larger ones (with more teeth) if you can find them,
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Lars Kristian
Posted on: August 2nd, 2006, 07:29:49 Quote Report to Moderator
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Hi,

yes, its the big nylon gearwheel. Do you know where i can find one with less than 110 degrees - say 70-80?

/lars
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Nick Evans
Posted on: August 2nd, 2006, 12:58:20 Quote Report to Moderator
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many years ago (before the mini marcos club was going or reserrected!) i read an article in a marcos owners club magazine by a friar who owned a jem, and he listed a whole range of british leyland cars, and the sweep of their wiper motors.
this led to me using a motor out a morris marina for my jem.
if its the later, round bodied motor (as opposed to the early square bodied one), the degrees of sweep is actually written on the large nylon gear wheel.

hope this helps.
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