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  Author    A few questions  (currently 5,375 views)
Alex_Rowbottom
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 08:39:48 Quote Report to Moderator
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I will have a look inti college courses and see what there is around, if there isn't anything then I guess I will have to forget the idea or get someone to make it for me.


Quoted from Rodger Howard, posted May 26th, 2014, 08:07:50 at here
I understand the principle " because i can" as much as any other person given the lengths i have gone with my car...
However, what is the point of a 400 hp carbon panelled marcos?
Do you honestly expect it to handle?




As said previously it's for track use, how do you mean by do you expect it to handle?


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Alex_Rowbottom
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 11:25:59 Quote Report to Moderator
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I have been looking this morning as you may know about the course but there is no college in my area that actually offer the course and if I have found one they will only do it if a group of 10 go so I may have to keep looking into how to make an effective/ good working carbon fibre or could I do top layer carbon fibre then fibreglass layers under neath?

Alex
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Stuart
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 11:32:37 Quote Report to Moderator
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With 400 hp the extra of weight of GRP against Carbon isn't going to be so noticeable is it ?
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mike brown
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 11:38:01 Quote Report to Moderator
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They took a 120hp "standard" mk1 mini Marcos to le mans raced it for 24hrs against gt40's it finished which is more than most! I have owned a metro turbo powered jem (90hp) and driven my brothers racer (120hp) both wheel spin for a pastime and can clear 100mph. Believe me when I say drive a "normal" one learn to drive it (you will need to relearn driving) then start modifying it to make it better for your use if that means 400hp etc so be it. Most people on here have had mini Marcos for years love them for what they are (a 1960's sports car that is quick but NOT fast) so modifications are to improve not redesign. These cars are addictive and a whole load of fun around speed limits ish good luck with your search we all here to help the best we can.
Mike
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Alex_Rowbottom
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 12:08:39 Quote Report to Moderator
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Does anyone else have any moulds apart from yourself mike?

I know that a lot of people aren't keen on the conversion i am thinking of, but it's just an idea I used to do a bit of track racing when I was younger but gave up for my career as a chef bad mistake I can tell you now. But as said it's just an idea I'm toying with at the moment id like to do the vtec conversion but I know it's going to be hard to get it to fit into the engine bay with out modifications to the shell itself. Because of where I work I have got talking to a gentleman who is a Dr in engineering and has offered to help with the build.
But as said if possible I would like to get hold of some moulds and go from there, if needs be I'll scrap the carbon fibre idea and just do fibreglassing as I know a lot more about that then carbon fibreing as there is extra steps involved as said like vaccum bagging the panels while resin is going into the fibres to make it bond together.

Alex
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mike brown
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 13:33:00 Quote Report to Moderator
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Please don't take me as saying don't do it I just want you to understand exactly what your trying to do. Don't forget a mini Marcos is monocoque ie no chassis.
Mike
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Joost van Dien
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 13:46:20 Quote Report to Moderator
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Drive it as much as possible!


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There is a full "carbon" mini marcos Clicky>http://www.minimarcos.org.uk/memcars/8026/index.html
The guy took a mould from his original car and got through the proces of making one. It took ages if you look at the data on his website. As already mentioned you maybe end up with a very light car without any traction. Good luck.

About the carbon itself. A friend of mine made a few 2mm carbon panels for me at his work (they make carbon masts for the volvo ocean race). After they came out of the oven they were bent, he forgot to lay the layers the correct way. You won't see this on a 10mm panel, but the tension is in the material! As Mike says, you need experience.

Last modified May 26th, 2014, 13:56:39 by Joost van Dien
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Graham Bichard
Posted on: May 26th, 2014, 19:23:09 Quote Report to Moderator
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Alex,  have you thought of a fwd bike engine conversion?
I'm sure there are Yamaha R1 conversions for he mini.  It shouldn't be too hard to utilise a 'Busa engine instead.  This wouldn't give you the 4wd you mentioned, but should certainly give you the power you're after, especially if turbocharged.
The idea of the CRV 4wd Marcos does sound good though  .
I'd tend to agree with Stuart though, and suggest sticking with the GRP shell (with carbon bonnet, tailgate, doors if you like) but for a dedicated track car I'd want a substantial cage (plenty of pictures on the forum of peoples solutions).
But with 16v A-Series conversions, Suzuki Swift conversions, how about a K-Series Rover, or a super/turbo A-Series - there must be something to take your fancy!
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Alex_Rowbottom
Posted on: May 27th, 2014, 00:48:47 Quote Report to Moderator
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I have thought about a bike conversion but looking into it it's more expensive as it's a complete kit and you can't fabricate one yourself and a reverse gear is a problem.
I looked into buying a hayabusa engine with an ecu, to buy it's roughly 1000 - 2000, the vtec option is a cheaper route to go down by the look of things as you can get a vtec engine at around 190bhp for 750 I do like the idea of 4wd system but I would need to modify the floor panel to do so.
I'm thinking of forgetting the idea of a carbon fibre marcos and go for carbon fibre bonnet, doors and tailgate but I'd prefer one that has a fixed rear window instead though.
Cage wise I'd look at one made by caged and go for an fia approved one with door bars, roof cross section and harness bar and if possible through the bulkhead and connect to the subframe to try and make the shell a bit more rigid, bucket seat ideally recaro pole positions if possible with either 6 or 8 point harness' and Hans.
I have had a look into other engine conversions bike engines as stated, vtec and redtop turbos (vauxhall cavalier gsi turbo engine). My daily drive at the moment is a 1.4 mg zr but the k series have a lot of problems with them as I am currently witnessing.

Alex
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Stuart
Posted on: May 27th, 2014, 07:35:00 Quote Report to Moderator
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Have you seen the C20XE powered racer Mike built ?




http://www.minimarcos.org.uk/memcars/7354/index.html
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Alex_Rowbottom
Posted on: May 27th, 2014, 11:25:14 Quote Report to Moderator
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I like the look of that, I'd prefer to do a front mounted conversions then the rear to be honest
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Brian
Posted on: May 27th, 2014, 16:09:30 Quote Report to Moderator
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Re: carbon fiber hood/doors/etc, the doors are very light as is -- fiberglass version is, I'm guessing, less than 2.5kg for the doors, and less than 1kg for bonnet. So, there isn't a ton of room for weight savings there.

I did save a lot of weight by using a 1.5 kg LiFePo battery. And aluminum radius arms and brakes all around. Granted, I may need to add most of that weight savings back to the car as ballast -- as it is, I can pick the rear end off the ground with one hand.
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Alex_Rowbottom
Posted on: May 27th, 2014, 20:29:17 Quote Report to Moderator
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How much does a bare shell weigh?
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mike brown
Posted on: May 27th, 2014, 20:52:09 Quote Report to Moderator
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Not sure what a bare shell weighs but my last road trim Marcos was 610kg all up.
Mike
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John Dickens
Posted on: May 27th, 2014, 21:10:24 Quote Report to Moderator
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If you just want the cosmetic appearance of carbon fibre you can use one layer of it behind clear gel coat then laminate the rest in GRP but  you need a lot of experience in epoxy/carbon techniques before you attempt to laminate a one piece structural body chassis unit.

Much of the strength of the MM structure comes from it's one piece construction and its a tricky shape to vac bag. Hand lay up would not give the same strength. You can bond a few pieces together but the bond line between the glue and the panel will always be the weak point.

Epoxy resins also need overcoating as they deteriorate on exposure to UV light.
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